https://www.skhynix.com/products/computing/view.jsp?info.ramKind=19&info...
ok i've done the interface redesign which i will document properly later: SATA is gone, 2nd USB is in, i added one EINT and the 4th pin is a VREF output for GPIO and UART voltage levels.
i also noticed that hynix do a 4gbit x8 RAM chip which is pin-compatible with the H5TQ2G83BFR, so i *think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
thoughts?
l.
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 21:04, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
so i*think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
Good news! It could be a reasonably capable machine.
yeah. now we have to test it, at least creating a batch of minimum 5 CPU Cards. just to be on the safe side, probably make 3 with 2Gbyte RAM and 2 with 1 Gbyte RAM. i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
joe if i get you the modified pcb layout can you handle getting this sorted (PCB printed, populated etc.)?
l.
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 10:14 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 22:39, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
I'll contribute (you can give me a board if one is left over and still works after testing). We need to make this happen.
you're a star.
Anybody else?
i get paid in a few days. if there are a few more willing people i should be able to cover the remainder.
l.
I would, but I'm a starving college student developing educational hardware and software, if you'd asked me a month earlier or month later I'd probably have had the cash to help out.
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 3:14 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 22:39, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
I'll contribute (you can give me a board if one is left over and still works after testing). We need to make this happen.
Anybody else?
Boris
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On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 10:20 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
I would, but I'm a starving college student developing educational hardware and software, if you'd asked me a month earlier or month later I'd probably have had the cash to help out.
no problem paul, we will get there
... hey you're not planning to do what one guy i heard about at imperial college did, are you? he got his university grant in (this was 1987), paid his accommodation, then bought the best hi-fi stereo he could get, with the rest. with the small change he went down to a local farmer's market, bought several huge bags of oats, emptied the drawers in his room, lined them with newspaper and poured in the oats. anyway, a few months later the hospital said that he was the first case of scurvy they had seen in decades :)
l.
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton lkcl@lkcl.net writes:
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 10:20 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
I would, but I'm a starving college student developing educational hardware and software, if you'd asked me a month earlier or month later I'd probably have had the cash to help out.
no problem paul, we will get there
... hey you're not planning to do what one guy i heard about at imperial college did, are you? he got his university grant in (this was 1987), paid his accommodation, then bought the best hi-fi stereo he could get, with the rest. with the small change he went down to a local farmer's market, bought several huge bags of oats, emptied the drawers in his room, lined them with newspaper and poured in the oats. anyway, a few months later the hospital said that he was the first case of scurvy they had seen in decades :)
I heard that one as being about a Manchester student, so either I told you that story and its morphed into an IC student since, or (perhaps more likely) it's an urban legend.
Cheers, Phil.
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 7:10 PM, Philip Hands phil@hands.com wrote:
[...] it's an urban legend.
Bingo. When *I* heard of it, it was institution-nonspecific, and it referred to a fellow who ate nothing but ramen (super cheap instant noodles, if you're outside the States) for an entire semester. Not to mention that, after an entire semester of Nissin (or Maruchan if you prefer it), his sodium levels would've given the Atlantic Ocean a run for its money -- that crap is hardly anything but salt and simple carbohydrates...
ok joe i've completed the routing, SATA was a bitch i had to put in about 4 sets of VIAs and use the POWER layer for a short duration around the SoC's BGA grid, but it's done. the big parallel groups, RGB/TTL, HDMI, Ethernet, NAND and SD/MMC all got subtly shuffled and shifted but mr xul has them all grouped veery neatly together, so i have confidence that those subtle shifts would have added roughly the same length to each.
btw i chickened out of adding a RESET/POWER line by taking over one of the 5V lines - i feel it's too complicated to put in right now.
i'm happy for someone else to check this over - i will upload it for ftp download, can you let your friend know? also i will contact the PCB factory we have been using, their guy patrick is extremely competent, he has been helping do verification of the PCBs we have been doing and he has helped pick up errors in the past.
l.
On Sun, 2014-06-01 at 18:22 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
ok joe i've completed the routing, SATA was a bitch i had to put in about 4 sets of VIAs and use the POWER layer for a short duration around the SoC's BGA grid, but it's done. the big parallel groups, RGB/TTL, HDMI, Ethernet, NAND and SD/MMC all got subtly shuffled and shifted but mr xul has them all grouped veery neatly together, so i have confidence that those subtle shifts would have added roughly the same length to each.
btw i chickened out of adding a RESET/POWER line by taking over one of the 5V lines - i feel it's too complicated to put in right now.
i'm happy for someone else to check this over - i will upload it for ftp download, can you let your friend know? also i will contact the PCB factory we have been using, their guy patrick is extremely competent, he has been helping do verification of the PCBs we have been doing and he has helped pick up errors in the past.
Upload the gerbers and schematic and point. I download, check and get a cost. The 2GB RAM is a winner. (It will need a new script.fex to get it going I assume?)
same place as last time. please arrange your friend to run and generate gerbers i am very busy
On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 7:51 AM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
On Sun, 2014-06-01 at 18:22 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
ok joe i've completed the routing, SATA was a bitch i had to put in about 4 sets of VIAs and use the POWER layer for a short duration around the SoC's BGA grid, but it's done. the big parallel groups, RGB/TTL, HDMI, Ethernet, NAND and SD/MMC all got subtly shuffled and shifted but mr xul has them all grouped veery neatly together, so i have confidence that those subtle shifts would have added roughly the same length to each.
btw i chickened out of adding a RESET/POWER line by taking over one of the 5V lines - i feel it's too complicated to put in right now.
i'm happy for someone else to check this over - i will upload it for ftp download, can you let your friend know? also i will contact the PCB factory we have been using, their guy patrick is extremely competent, he has been helping do verification of the PCBs we have been doing and he has helped pick up errors in the past.
Upload the gerbers and schematic and point. I download, check and get a cost. The 2GB RAM is a winner. (It will need a new script.fex to get it going I assume?)
arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook Send large attachments to arm-netbook@files.phcomp.co.uk
So I can't find the page where this was discussed but I was told that the reason we couldn't go to a Quad-Core processor A31 was not because of pin compatibility but because it utilized a different graphics processor which we didn't really have open source for, a PowerVR instead of the Mali-400. We today they announced the A33 which uses the same Mali-400MP2 that the A20 uses, so is it possible to go to quad-core now?
If i'm completely wrong please let me know. I also heard that it can use USB3 but I could be mistaken.
On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 1:00 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton lkcl@lkcl.net wrote:
same place as last time. please arrange your friend to run and generate gerbers i am very busy
On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 7:51 AM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
On Sun, 2014-06-01 at 18:22 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
ok joe i've completed the routing, SATA was a bitch i had to put in about 4 sets of VIAs and use the POWER layer for a short duration around the SoC's BGA grid, but it's done. the big parallel groups, RGB/TTL, HDMI, Ethernet, NAND and SD/MMC all got subtly shuffled and shifted but mr xul has them all grouped veery neatly together, so i have confidence that those subtle shifts would have added roughly the same length to each.
btw i chickened out of adding a RESET/POWER line by taking over one of the 5V lines - i feel it's too complicated to put in right now.
i'm happy for someone else to check this over - i will upload it for ftp download, can you let your friend know? also i will contact the PCB factory we have been using, their guy patrick is extremely competent, he has been helping do verification of the PCBs we have been doing and he has helped pick up errors in the past.
Upload the gerbers and schematic and point. I download, check and get a cost. The 2GB RAM is a winner. (It will need a new script.fex to get it going I assume?)
arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook Send large attachments to arm-netbook@files.phcomp.co.uk
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On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 10:14 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
So I can't find the page where this was discussed but I was told that the reason we couldn't go to a Quad-Core processor A31 was not because of pin compatibility but because it utilized a different graphics processor which we didn't really have open source for, a PowerVR instead of the Mali-400. We today they announced the A33 which uses the same Mali-400MP2 that the A20 uses, so is it possible to go to quad-core now?
ooooo yes! hooray! if it's pin-compatible with the A20 we can use it straight away.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:prYbhMDZblEJ:www.allwin...
ok it's pin-compatible with the A23. with the removal of SATA and replacement with USB it can be done. i'll ask for some PCB CAD files.
l.
On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 10:55 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton lkcl@lkcl.net wrote:
On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 10:14 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
So I can't find the page where this was discussed but I was told that the reason we couldn't go to a Quad-Core processor A31 was not because of pin compatibility but because it utilized a different graphics processor which we didn't really have open source for, a PowerVR instead of the Mali-400. We today they announced the A33 which uses the same Mali-400MP2 that the A20 uses, so is it possible to go to quad-core now?
ooooo yes! hooray! if it's pin-compatible with the A20 we can use it straight away.
Christopher Havel laserhawk64@gmail.com writes:
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 7:10 PM, Philip Hands phil@hands.com wrote:
[...] it's an urban legend.
Bingo. When *I* heard of it, it was institution-nonspecific, and it referred to a fellow who ate nothing but ramen (super cheap instant noodles, if you're outside the States) for an entire semester. Not to mention that, after an entire semester of Nissin (or Maruchan if you prefer it), his sodium levels would've given the Atlantic Ocean a run for its money -- that crap is hardly anything but salt and simple carbohydrates...
Ah right, that made it worth looking up:
http://www.snopes.com/college/horrors/scurvy.asp
The cited version at the start there is pretty much exactly the version I heard, with the addition of the detail that he was supposed to be frying the porridge stored in he chest of drawers, which is a nice touch given that it's supposed to be a Scot ;-)
Cheers, Phil.
On Fri, 2014-05-30 at 21:39 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 21:04, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
so i*think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
Good news! It could be a reasonably capable machine.
yeah. now we have to test it, at least creating a batch of minimum 5 CPU Cards. just to be on the safe side, probably make 3 with 2Gbyte RAM and 2 with 1 Gbyte RAM. i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
joe if i get you the modified pcb layout can you handle getting this sorted (PCB printed, populated etc.)?
No problem, but remember, as company we still need the SATA.
It would be good if you can put in some wings that can be broken off that has SATA and a lot more IO coming out of FPC. The wings should be at the HDMI end because there are a lot of PCMCIA cases with bulges at that end for SATA, ethernet, wifi and so on.
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 1:17 PM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
On Fri, 2014-05-30 at 21:39 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 21:04, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
so i*think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
Good news! It could be a reasonably capable machine.
yeah. now we have to test it, at least creating a batch of minimum 5 CPU Cards. just to be on the safe side, probably make 3 with 2Gbyte RAM and 2 with 1 Gbyte RAM. i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
joe if i get you the modified pcb layout can you handle getting this sorted (PCB printed, populated etc.)?
No problem, but remember, as company we still need the SATA.
aw f**** :)
It would be good if you can put in some wings that can be broken off that has SATA and a lot more IO coming out of FPC. The wings should be at the HDMI end
there isn't enough space to do that....
ohhh waaait, i got one. there is *just* enough room to put an FPC20 underneath the MicroSD. 4 pins SATA.
i should just about be able to route the TS/CS group 0 (pin group PE0-PE11) through to it via a couple of routes.
that's 16 pins... actually if i make it TS/CS group 1 (pin group PG0-PG11) that would also give multiplex access to SD1 as well.
2 GND... 18... 1 5V 1 3.3V that's 20.
.... that good enough?
l.
On Sat, 2014-05-31 at 14:39 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 1:17 PM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
On Fri, 2014-05-30 at 21:39 +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Boris Barbour barbour@biologie.ens.fr wrote:
On 30/05/14 21:04, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
so i*think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
Good news! It could be a reasonably capable machine.
yeah. now we have to test it, at least creating a batch of minimum 5 CPU Cards. just to be on the safe side, probably make 3 with 2Gbyte RAM and 2 with 1 Gbyte RAM. i'm guessing we will need somewhere around $1.5k for 5 boards including components.
joe if i get you the modified pcb layout can you handle getting this sorted (PCB printed, populated etc.)?
No problem, but remember, as company we still need the SATA.
aw f**** :)
It would be good if you can put in some wings that can be broken off that has SATA and a lot more IO coming out of FPC. The wings should be at the HDMI end
there isn't enough space to do that....
ohhh waaait, i got one. there is *just* enough room to put an FPC20 underneath the MicroSD. 4 pins SATA.
i should just about be able to route the TS/CS group 0 (pin group PE0-PE11) through to it via a couple of routes.
that's 16 pins... actually if i make it TS/CS group 1 (pin group PG0-PG11) that would also give multiplex access to SD1 as well.
2 GND... 18... 1 5V 1 3.3V that's 20.
.... that good enough?
One 20 pin FPC at the microSD end of the EOMA with SATA and more IO pins ought to enough for anyone (TM).
Alternatively a SATA, a second USB in exchange for reduced IO pins ought to be enough for anyone else (TM).
The GND, 5V, 3.3V essential.
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 7:32 PM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
.... that good enough?
One 20 pin FPC at the microSD end of the EOMA with SATA and more IO pins ought to enough for anyone (TM).
ok done.
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 7:42 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton lkcl@lkcl.net wrote:
On Sat, May 31, 2014 at 7:32 PM, joem joem@martindale-electric.co.uk wrote:
.... that good enough?
One 20 pin FPC at the microSD end of the EOMA with SATA and more IO pins ought to enough for anyone (TM).
ok done.
oo, you might just be a jammy git joe. i'm not very happy (i.e. uncomfortable) with the amount of shifting around of things like the ethernet, sd/mmc. NAND and HDMI that's had to take place, but i think we will get away with it. getting SATA out is a complete bitch: i may have to use the power plane for a few mm, it is very very tight around the BGA CPU pins, but i at least have the tracks routed to within 8mm of their destination, which is good news. not too much of a mess, had to switch layers more times than i would like, but it is actually going to fit.
more later.
l.
So they'll be 3 USB outputs on the card in total? I imagine the one that was added will be USB 3.0.
Are the USB's just a pinout? no extra hardware other than adding a port? OTG?
2GB of RAM sounds great! Should give the EOMA-68 a good running chance.
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl@lkcl.net
wrote:
https://www.skhynix.com/products/computing/view.jsp?info.ramKind=19&info...
ok i've done the interface redesign which i will document properly later: SATA is gone, 2nd USB is in, i added one EINT and the 4th pin is a VREF output for GPIO and UART voltage levels.
i also noticed that hynix do a 4gbit x8 RAM chip which is pin-compatible with the H5TQ2G83BFR, so i *think* we can go to 2gbyte of RAM.
thoughts?
l.
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On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:21 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
So they'll be 3 USB outputs on the card in total?
yes. 2 USB2 480mbit/sec, 1 USB-OTG, also 480mbdit/sec
I imagine the one that was added will be USB 3.0.
no, because the A20, which is being used in this first EOMA68-compliant CPU Card, does not have USB3.
Are the USB's just a pinout? no extra hardware other than adding a port?
correct.
OTG?
yes.
2GB of RAM sounds great! Should give the EOMA-68 a good running chance.
EOMA-68 is an interface standard, not a computer. i assume you mean the EOMA68-A20 CPU Card.
l.
no, because the A20, which is being used in this first EOMA68-compliant
CPU Card, does not have USB3.
I understand the A20 doesn't have USB3, but does that mean all EOMA-68 cards cannot have USB3? I have USB3 devices that default to USB2 speeds when the device isn't equipped with USB3, but I think USB3 requires 5 extra pins.
EOMA-68 is an interface standard, not a computer. i assume you mean the
EOMA68-A20 CPU Card.
Yes, but I suppose it would also give the standard a good chance if the first card out has decent specs.
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 2:35 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl@lkcl.net
wrote:
On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:21 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
So they'll be 3 USB outputs on the card in total?
yes. 2 USB2 480mbit/sec, 1 USB-OTG, also 480mbdit/sec
I imagine the one that was added will be USB 3.0.
no, because the A20, which is being used in this first EOMA68-compliant CPU Card, does not have USB3.
Are the USB's just a pinout? no extra hardware other than adding a port?
correct.
OTG?
yes.
2GB of RAM sounds great! Should give the EOMA-68 a good running chance.
EOMA-68 is an interface standard, not a computer. i assume you mean the EOMA68-A20 CPU Card.
l.
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On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 10:00 PM, Paul NeoStormer paulneostormer@gmail.com wrote:
no, because the A20, which is being used in this first EOMA68-compliant CPU Card, does not have USB3.
I understand the A20 doesn't have USB3, but does that mean all EOMA-68 cards cannot have USB3?
paul, please look at the specification.
Yes, but I suppose it would also give the standard a good chance if the first card out has decent specs.
there are several barriers to entry for that to happen immediately. if you have around $25k spare and contacts with any of the SoC manufacturers that have USB3, and are happy to sign their NDAs, and we are happy to delay the project by another four to six months getting through all that, then it can be done.
so, we do this first CPU Card. which is ready to go.
l.
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Philip Hands