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Re: [Arm-netbook] usb keyboard, width about 15cm?
by ronwirring＠Safe-mail.net 31 May '17

31 May '17

-------- Original Message -------- From: Nick Bannon <nick-eoma68(a)rcpt.to> Apparently from: arm-netbook-bounces(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk To: arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] usb keyboard, width about 15cm? Date: Wed, 31 May 2017 12:21:34 +0800 > On Mon, May 29, 2017 at 04:48:03PM -0400, ronwirring(a)Safe-mail.net wrote: > > http://usb.brando.com/prod_detail.php?prod_id=00666 > > Promising! but as Christopher mentioned, "This item is Discontinued". > > I had luck searching for another 56 key keyboard ("50%"?): USD $23.73 Good find. It looks to be the same keyboard. > > http://www.dx.com/p/mini-56-key-usb-keyboard-with-retractable-usb-cable-for… > http://www.dx.com/p/15953 > http://www.dx.com/c/computers-tablets-networking-399/keyboards-302/USB-351 > > The X/Y dimensions are very similar, though it's 60% heavier and 5mm thicker. > Dimensions: 6.69 in x 2.91 in x 0.79 in (170 x 74 x 20 mm) > Weight: 6.53 oz (185g) > > I think I'd miss the dedicated arrow keys. > I'd like it even more if it had an integrated trackball or trackpoint, That would make it much easier to integrate it in a pc card cabinet. I have searched for wired usb touchpads and trackpoints. I have not found any. > which I guess requires a USB hub device/emulation as well?: > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pointing_stick > > Nick. > I have bought one 7usd bluetooth small keyboard. It appears to have a touchpad too. I cannot say how difficult it will be to modify it to a wired usb keyboard. There is the https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/images/Pyra-Main.png cabinet. If the 3d printer cad files are free software. > -- > Nick Bannon | "I made this letter longer than usual because > nick-sig(a)rcpt.to | I lack the time to make it shorter." - Pascal > > _______________________________________________ > arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk > http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook > Send large attachments to arm-netbook(a)files.phcomp.co.uk

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Re: [Arm-netbook] firefly 3399 all source software disclosed?
by ronwirring＠Safe-mail.net 31 May '17

31 May '17

-------- Original Message -------- From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> Apparently from: arm-netbook-bounces(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk To: Eco-Conscious Computing <arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] firefly 3399 all source software disclosed? Date: Wed, 31 May 2017 06:15:57 +0100 > ron: what you're about to attempt is called "coercion". it's > unethical. the principles behind the libre concept are that ethics > come first: very few people in the libre world actually truly > understand that, because they think it's about the technology or about > the "four freedoms" as specifically defined and laid out. > > people need to be free to make their own choices. firefly (Acer) have > made their choice - as they are entirely at liberty to do - to release > the full source code of the SOFTWARE and NOT the hardware. > > if you attempt to coerce them into doing something that they have not > themselves chosen to do, they will not react as you intend, i > guarantee it. > > so please don't do it: it's unethical. > > l. > It is not common to debate strategy on a public mailing list. Because this is a minor matter and I do not believe I will get the data I want from firefly no matter what, I will tell what I wanted to do. I believe their kickstarter webpage is misleading and deceptive. They write the hardware is open source. Likely it is not legally established what defines open source hardware. I would say every piece of data and software about the computer has to be open source. It is about what the buyer of an item reasonably can expect. Not what seller decides by himself. To my knowledge seller has made no reservations on kickstarter. Then I say, he has to hand over what data seller has. They are supposed to be professionals. If they screw up in their ad, it is their problem. Arguments saying it is their data and business platform are not relevant. I am located in eu. Firefly is located in china. If firefly will not hand over the data I want, I will have to sue them in china or usa, if that is where kickstarter is located. I am not going to do that. If firefly refuses to provide the data, I am going to file a complaint to kickstarter about firefly. I tried to get the data. Wrote them and see what happens. Maybe firefly by mistake would provide the data. Did I believe it would work? No. https://youtu.be/6o_mVPwHYnk?t=1007 You may call it coercion and unethical. I do it anyway. Because I am weighing it up against my privacy and computer security. I cannot buy new libre software computers which have all devices enabled. > _______________________________________________ > arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk > http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook > Send large attachments to arm-netbook(a)files.phcomp.co.uk

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Re: [Arm-netbook] firefly 3399 all source software disclosed?
by ronwirring＠Safe-mail.net 31 May '17

31 May '17

In a previous post, lkcl wrote the firefly rk3399 staff has the pcb cad files and he had no objection about firefly rejecting, which they have done towards me, to email the cad files. About lkcl's crowd funding, the mali gpu source code is not available. Lkcl can make the mali gpu source code not available, because he makes a reservation in the text in his ad. About the pcb cad files, lkcl has decided they will not be available until lkcl decides to provide them. I disagree on the decision. Being open source I find it implicit that all data will be provided immediately. Because lkcl has made a reservation in his ad about the cad files in question he can make that choice. In the firefly rk3399' ad it says, the hardware is open source. The ad is misleading and deceptive. I have found no reservations about the mali gpu source code or the pcb cad files. Firefly can probably not email the mali gpu source code, because they do not have it. They can email the pcb cad files because they have them. That is why I am going to demand both the mali gpu source code and the pcb cad files from firefly. If firefly does not provide the data in question, then I will file a complaint to kickstarter. It is unacceptable calling something open source, if it is not all open source. Of cource I will not mention lkcl in any form. -------- Original Message -------- From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> Apparently from: arm-netbook-bounces(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk To: Eco-Conscious Computing <arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] firefly 3399 all source software disclosed? Date: Tue, 30 May 2017 03:19:57 +0100 > --- > crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 > > > On Mon, May 29, 2017 at 10:12 PM, David Niklas <doark(a)mail.com> wrote: > > On Mon, 8 May 2017 05:45:36 +0100 > > Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> wrote: > >> --- > >> crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 > >> > >> > >> On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 10:10 PM, zap <zapper(a)openmailbox.org> wrote: > >> > > >> > > >> > On 05/07/2017 04:29 PM, ronwirring(a)Safe-mail.net wrote: > >> >> All software for the mali-t860 is open source? > >> > >> none. MALI is proprietary. > > > > I'm confused. > > Luke, if you plan on making an RK3399 into an eoma project how can you > > get RYF status if the mali GPU is closed source? > > this was discussed a year ago or so. same process as for the EOMA68-A20 > > > For that matter, how can you get RYF cert. for your current eoma68 > > project? > > by leaving out the proprietary crap, simple as that. see below. > > > Unless I'm mistaken and it uses a different GPU? > > it is actually a different GPU but that does not change the > assessment process carried out by the FSF. > > > Or you just leave the HW crippled? > > if the FSF considered the device to be "crippled" by it not having > the 3D engine running, such that there was a genuine risk that people > would actively seek out the installation of proprietary software. > > in the case of e.g. a proprietary on-board WIFI device that *would* > constitute a genuine risk of people *actively* seeking out proprietary > firmware, and consequently the FSF quite naturally refuses to certify > devices that contain non-removable proprietary on-board WIFI chips. > > however in this case it actually turns out that if you use the > proprietary 3D GPU for the tasks that i suspect you *believe* will > quotes accelerate quotes certain operations (such as X11), the MALI > embedded GPU (or its associated proprietary software - we can't > actually tell which because we DON'T HAVE THE DAMN SOURCE) is so > piss-poor at its job that it actually SLOWS DOWN CERTAIN OPERATIONS of > X11. > > given that 2D acceleration is already covered by fbturbo, and works > really well *and is entirely libre software*, the *need* for the 3D > engine just for basic Small-Office / Home-Office and day-to-day usage > is NOT A CONCERN. > > so does that make it clear that the evaluation process (which was > described a year ago) is not just a hard-and-fixed process? > > now, if on the other hand this was a dedicated Games Console product, > *that would be an entirely different matter*. applying for RYF > Certification on a 3D Games Console product which has a 3D GPU which > *only works with proprietary software* would probably constitute too > much of a risk that buyers *WOULD* in fact go out of their way to > download the proprietary drivers. > > but this design *isn't being sold as a 3D Games Console*, is it? > > does that help clarify? > > l. > > _______________________________________________ > arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk > http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook > Send large attachments to arm-netbook(a)files.phcomp.co.uk

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Totally derailed topic
by David Niklas 31 May '17

31 May '17

On Tue, 9 May 2017 20:14:36 -0400 John Luke Gibson <eaterjolly(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 5/9/17, Lyberta <lyberta(a)lyberta.net> wrote: > > doark(a)mail.com: > >> I think you're caught in the same trap, unable to realize your own > >> potential for lack of a moral standard (it also suffers as a result > >> of an Atheistic philosophy), and unable to accept a pointless > >> existence. > > > > When I was 19, I was in a very bad situation. Everything I've ever > > believed in was false. So I've spent the next 6 months looking for > > truth. Thankfully, I have dropped out of college by this time so I had > > time to investigate. Investigation is a good idea. If I may what college? What were you planning to major in? > > And in one moment it dawned upon me. There is no truth. Everything is > > relative. People invent their own truth and start believing in it. So > > if I want to stay unshackled I must not believe in anything. Think of a pendulum, now compare with what you just wrote............. The solution to your problem is not to "believe" or not to "believe" (belief is actually a REQUIREMENT of live since we could not decide about anything that is uncertain with out it). If you walk up to a person how do you tell whether or not they speak English well? Whether they can use big words? Do you start with something extremely simple or not? Or, for another example, Luke did not know whether or not he would succeed in completing the eoma68, or if it would be on time. He tries his best, but he still does not know if that is good enough. > > The next thing was supposed to be suicide but I couldn't do it. I > > don't know the future and I don't know what will happen when I die. > > In fact, I'm trapped inside my own consciousness and by definition > > can't escape it and see the truth. Remember Plato's allegory of the > > cave? This is one of the last things you'll learn in philosophy. > > Another thing that bugs me is, since I don't believe in anything, I > > also don't believe in science. I can't predict what's gonna happen in > > the next moment. Every once in a while I get in this state of mind > > where I understand that I understand nothing. Nonsense, we are in an action-reaction universe, observe the actions and you aught to be able to determine the reactions. > >> In any and all cases I think you might enjoy a book that is > >> eyeopening, insightful and uplifting, with respect to the world > >> around you, as opposed to your more dreary, despairing, world view. > > > > I was forced to read books at school and this gave a huge hatred for > > them. I remember I've tried to read a fiction book at psychiatric > > hospital and after the 1st paragraph I was so enraged that I quickly > > put it away. Though this mostly applies to fiction. > > Ouch! I had the identical experience, but I took the opportunity to read a nasty book to record all it's mistakes, thus I not only learned about the stupid things people write about but I am quite able to refute them. I always thought that fiction aught to reflect reality, to bring out what is. Spoke to my mother about you, see suggested watching a TV program on EWTN (not that I watch EWTN but maybe it would heklp...) God the universe and everything By Matt Fradd On June 18 12:00 AM (EST?) > > The mountains of religious thought pumped into this thread has it > visibly oozing (I mean no offense). Ooh, it's coming to get you :) > Firstly, the speaker in that video > linked @zap I'm familiar with and is very unreliable when their claims > are checked or researched. Secondly, Nietzsche explores that so-called > "trap". The thing is that religion presents the concept of morality > which fills the space created by ennui and lack of obstacles to > self-preservation. Noam Chomsky popularized abit the thought that the > consistent trend in nature is more intelligent species tend to go > extinct after a shorter period than obviously less intelligent ones > (i.e. beetles), this is due to genetic drift and inbred weaknesses due > to a lack of obstacles to their survival. Ethics is an artificial > obstacle we present ourselves in order to keep us strong (Nietzsche > referred to the model used by Christianity as Slave Morality, > suggesting that the ethics therein enslave the subscriber to the whims > and desires of the less fortunate, and thusly purporting the existence > of less fortunate as ENDEMICALLY NECESSARY because without less > fortunate people then there would be point to the ethics of > christianity and therefore there would be no obstacle to occupy > ourselves with and therefore genetic drift would set in and we would > die as a species. In other words, Nietzsche considered christianity so > obsessed with compassion, that in a world without suffering it would > utterly and completely fall apart.). > So people like Lyberta are causing genetic impurity and aught to be? > Nietzsche's life's work was dedicated to attempting to create a > well-developed replacement to both religion and "Slave Morality". > > I don't know if I support Nietzsche's alternative of "Master Morality" Then what do you support? > (where the obstacle is to become the best human possible, the > so-called "ubermensch"), but I do say that "trap" is hardly a "trap" > rather it's just a human need for an obstacle or conflict, and by > rejecting religion all one is doing is rejecting the type of conflict > which that religion endorses. <snip> How about inherent insufficiency? Or you can just <--insert favourite word-->. the very best, David

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Existential 3D Printing Moments
by doark＠mail.com 31 May '17

31 May '17

On Fri, 19 May 2017 01:42:52 +0100 Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> wrote: > > On Fri, May 19, 2017 at 12:35 AM, Neil Jansen <njansen1(a)gmail.com> > wrote: <snip> > now, neil, this is the kind of speed at which an arduino 2560 *cannot > cope*, and, also, where the design flaws inherent in RAMPS - using > prototyping Evaluation Boards (polulu-style drivers) - start to show > up. Could you be more specific? Why can't the arduino cope? > david crocket (dc42) has specifically designed the duet series so that > you can consider exceeding PWM rates of 150 khz, which is what you > need if you want to sustain 500mm/sec for example (and do not want > problems to occur at speeds well below that). Link? > also i forgot to mention that i've been using the E3Dv6 "volcano" > which, when you use a 0.5 to 0.8mm nozzle can easily do flow rates of > something mad like.... 200c^3/min - particularly when combined with > the huge 40:1 gearing of the flex3drive which can *accurately* deliver > the kinds of torque needed. the volcano basically turns the heat > chamber round, so that the heat area is 20mm long instead of the usual > 10mm. Torque for what? Again, maybe a link would help us stay on the same page. > none of this stuff i knew about, the 18 months before i began > designing the laptop's parts. oh well. I researched 3D printers thoroughly before I bought mine. I even started asking questions at a forum, and I'm still not too certain if I got what I sought. According to this list, I did worse when looking for hacker boards. So, you are not alone. <snip> > welcome to the list neil. really good talking with you. > > l. Indeed. Sincerely, David

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Side-Topic: Liberating PocketCHIP
by David Niklas 31 May '17

31 May '17

On Mon, 8 May 2017 16:38:22 +0100 Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> wrote: > On Mon, May 8, 2017 at 4:23 PM, <ronwirring(a)safe-mail.net> wrote: > > > Is it common to do something like this against a person? > > in the unethical business world? of course it is! mostly you don't > get to hear about it, but software libre developers are different. > they're not beholden to anyone, they're not corporate slaves, they're > not controlled and they are entitled to speak their mind. > > consequently they get attacked. especially if some fucker deems that > their "profit" is threatened. > > for example: there was some discussion back in 1999 as to whether > microsoft would ever take out a contract on my life, when i was doing > the reverse-engineering of NT domains. consequently i decided that > the research that i was doing had best be presented responsibly to > them as "security vulnerabilities", presented PRIVATELY to them (as a > responsible security researcher does) and only later disclosing them > if they didn't fix the problems in a reasonable timeframe. > > and that's why ISS hired me. the strategy that i deployed worked. > one microsoft employee actually called ISS up asking them to fire me. > ISS declined, pointing out that i was quite likely to get very pissed > off, and would they prefer me inside pissing out or outside pissing > in? they're absolutely right: i would have worked really really hard > to release one devastating public zero-day security vulnerability - > with full exploit code - every few days for several months, if they'd > fucked with me. <snip> I am just a tad confused. 1. You started a reverse engineering project on NT domains. 2. You presented your success to MS as a security problem. 3. You were hired. 4. Someone in MS complained. So, the FLOSS folks never saw your work anyway? Thanks, David

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Re: [Arm-netbook] a designing a low-cost decent 3d printing board
by David Niklas 31 May '17

31 May '17

On Tue, 23 May 2017 02:27:24 +0100 Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> wrote: <snip> > in particular i would very much like to "stack" the steppers because i > have a design where it is going to use *four* z-axes. in a first > iteration those may be wired up as 2x 2-serial in parallel, however it > would be very *very* nice to be able to just add a second "stack" of 4 > z-axis steppers and use them to do automatic bed-levelling. so to do > that it would mean having on-board jumpers that could select > alternative GPIO pins... or maybe to use an I2C-based or SPI-based > GPIO expander in order to reduce the amount of GPIO needed. <snip> Remember that as the weight and speed of the hot end increases the load on the z-axis motors and gears also increases (if temporarily), leading to (temporary), inaccuracies when using multi motor setups. If I were to use multiple motors I'd not do it like this: M == motor H == Hot end TOP SIDE M----M +-----+ | | |H | |H | -> | | M----M M-----M But rather like this: TOP SIDE +----+ M----+ | | H | | | -> | | M----+ M----+ Assuming I understand you rightly. Sincerely, David

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Re: [Arm-netbook] usb keyboard, width about 15cm?
by ronwirring＠Safe-mail.net 31 May '17

31 May '17

-------- Original Message -------- From: Christopher Havel <laserhawk64(a)gmail.com> Apparently from: arm-netbook-bounces(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk To: Eco-Conscious Computing <arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] usb keyboard, width about 15cm? Date: Sat, 27 May 2017 13:10:26 -0400 > The Bluetooth keyboards are Bluetooth only. > > Wired USB keyboard, that size? Never seen one. Would love to have one http://usb.brando.com/prod_detail.php?prod_id=00666 > myself; I've wanted to homebrew a waist-pack PC with wrist keyboard and > "google glass" style screen, since approximately a half hour after the dawn > of time. I've even got a viewfinder CRT out of an old camcorder that I > could use as the display if I hooked it up right. Trouble is I don't trust > BT to not interfere with everyone else and screw me up too... that, and I'd > need to make it work with a battery. > > Now that I think about it... I think I've seen one such keyboard literally > once ever, either by luck on eBay or on some other website. Don't remember > since it was at least five years ago. The thing commanded a princely sum, > too... like $150. > > It occurs to me as well that you might be able to get an > industrial/commercial duty wrist PC off eBay (be prepared to pay multiple > hundreds of dollars) and doof around with its built-in keyboard... or do > something with part of a cell phone and a Teensy... but that's real > jerry-rigging at best. There are also keyboards floating around for old > IPAQ PDAs that may be useful somehow... but you'd have to reverse-engineer > them and they look like they'd be horrible to use to begin with, you don't > even get most PC function keys (TAB, CTRL, ALT, etc). > > Good luck, and let me know if you find one... > _______________________________________________ > arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook(a)lists.phcomp.co.uk > http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook > Send large attachments to arm-netbook(a)files.phcomp.co.uk

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Side-Topic: Liberating PocketCHIP
by David Niklas 30 May '17

30 May '17

On Mon, 08 May 2017 09:59:50 +0100 "mike.valk(a)gmail.com" <mike.valk(a)gmail.com> wrote: > 2017-05-08 3:34 GMT+02:00 <doark(a)mail.com>: > > > I apologize for DOS'ing the list, I can only get online about once a > > week. > > > > On Thu, 4 May 2017 17:13:23 +0200 > > "mike.valk(a)gmail.com" <mike.valk(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > 2017-05-04 9:04 GMT+02:00 John Luke Gibson <eaterjolly(a)gmail.com>: > > > > > > > Since it seems like a trivially simple task that for some reason > > > > no one has taken up, I would like to take the opportunity to > > > > exercise a learning experience and simultaneously benefit the > > > > community, by liberating PocketCHIP by deblobbing the source and > > > > re-compiling. > > > > > > The PocketCHIP is powered by their SoM: > > > http://linux-sunxi.org/NextThingCo_CHIP > > > > > > That is apparently a Allwinner R8 pared with an external rtl8723bs > > > Wifi/BT chip. > > > > > > The R8 is a rebranded A13. > > What? I own one of those and I'm almost certain that the CPU is an A7. > > Let's boot the PocketCHIP up... > > The processor is detected as an A7. > > > > It should be a Cortex-A8. > http://linux-sunxi.org/Allwinner_SoC_Family > > The new chip GR8, which is specific SoC for NextThingCo, seems to be an > "sun5i" as well. Also a slightly modified A13 I guess. > > The're seems to but mainline support for it. Icenowy Zheng has addid it > I think. But the'res no wiki page fo it. > http://linux-sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort > http://linux-sunxi.org/GR8 Sorry, I (foolishly) though that ARMv7 == A7 (i.e. a contraction). > > > I'll attach the output, it would probably be interesting to see all of > > it... > > Done, it's compressed bzip2 since it's ~300KiB decompressed which is > > large for an email. > > > > Use pastebin or sorts. Or just cut out the specifica part. > Sorry, I thought the rest of it might be useful to look at. <snip> > > You're not giving us enough details. Who is Verhaegen? What did he > > burn out on? > > When I first considered purchasing a PocketCHiP I read about the GPU > > not having 3D capabilities because of a binary blob. So, the CHIP > > folks hired (I think it was an extended goal of the kickstarter > > campaign), a kernel dev to add support to the Linux kernel for the > > GPU. > > > That did not happen. The're is no Opensource linux driver for MALI. NTC > hardly involves itself with the linux-sunxi community. > > Their website is hardly obvious to the software needs of running their > hardware. > > How hard can it be.... > > "To use our hardware you have two options: Our BSP which has closed > source drivers, but you have full utilization of the hardware. Or use > the mainline kernel with some restrictions" Where is that quote from? > And state your involvement in freeing the hardware or not. > > NTC website is just one big selling machine. > Prior to purchasing the Pocket CHIP I read their docs and kickstarter page. See this (their kickstarter page says similar): https://docs.getchip.com/chip.html#is-chip-open-source-where-are-the-docs Are they flat out lying? Thanks, David

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Re: [Arm-netbook] firefly 3399 all source software disclosed?
by David Niklas 30 May '17

30 May '17

On Mon, 8 May 2017 05:45:36 +0100 Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl(a)lkcl.net> wrote: > --- > crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 > > > On Sun, May 7, 2017 at 10:10 PM, zap <zapper(a)openmailbox.org> wrote: > > > > > > On 05/07/2017 04:29 PM, ronwirring(a)Safe-mail.net wrote: > >> All software for the mali-t860 is open source? > > none. MALI is proprietary. I'm confused. Luke, if you plan on making an RK3399 into an eoma project how can you get RYF status if the mali GPU is closed source? For that matter, how can you get RYF cert. for your current eoma68 project? Unless I'm mistaken and it uses a different GPU? Or you just leave the HW crippled? Thanks, David

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